072: Telling the stories in between the dramatization and romanization of military life with Abi Ray

Jen Amos 0:00

Welcome to holding down the fort, a podcast show dedicated to curating knowledge, resources and relevant stories for today's military spouses so they can continue to make confident and informed decisions for themselves and their families. Because let's face it, we know who's really holding down the fort. I'm Jen a Moe's, a gold star, daughter, veteran spouse and your host for holding down the fort by us that wealth. Let's get started.

All right. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the foreword to a newly award winning podcast show. I'm your co host, Jenn Amos, and I have with me my other co host, Jenny Lynch troupe. Gentlemen, welcome back.

Unknown Speaker 0:49

Hey, thanks for having me. Glad to be here.

Jen Amos 0:52

Yes, and I know that you are especially excited for this conversation today, considering that you are a mental health advocate. And you have been involved with this magazine. So are you excited?

Speaker 1 1:02

Oh, man, I even put on lipstick today just for this interview. So that's how excited I am. Yeah, so super excited about this today. I love this organization and all that they do. Perfect. Alright.

Jen Amos 1:13

onal and relational lives. In: 2017

Speaker 2 1:55

Thank you, Jen, it's so good to be here. And we're a big fan of holding down the fort. And we're a big fan of Jenny Lynn. It's an honor to be here.

Jen Amos 2:05

Yeah, we're just gonna like fan girl all around. That's pretty much what's gonna happen today. Because we all just highly respect each other, and what we all do in our individual space. So I'm just really excited to get into a conversation with you today, Abby. And the first thing I want to bring up is the fact that you're a licensed counselor for the last 11 years. You know, as you mentioned, Jenny Lynn is a mental health advocate herself representing a mental health clinic. And I'm just all about it. Like I'm just all about, like promoting these resources. I'm even an active client of Cohen right now that Jenny Lynn represents. And so I just want to touch upon your professional career first, just because you know, people like you are so needed in our community. So let me just start off by saying thank you for what you do. And let me ask you, what's your favorite thing that you enjoy doing being a licensed counselor?

Speaker 2 2:55

So I would have to say that is seeing a client or a patient, kind of have those aha moments, those realizations that the way that they've lived for X amount of years isn't the way that they have to live moving forward. So when they embrace that internal drive to kind of try to view life through a different lens, right, whether that's their past experiences with trauma, whether that's conflict with a spouse, or that's hardships with their children, and just really seeing them, dig deep and ask some hard

Jen Amos 3:36

questions. Yeah, I can imagine how fun it is to witness that, you know, I think about the couples counseling sessions I have with my husband, and like, we didn't realize this, but we had a breakthrough. And the counselor stopped and said, Wait, wait, wait, wait, stop right there. Like you realize, like, what happened, like you realize, like the shift, and you're like, oh, yeah, you know, so it's just so cool to like, have that aha moment, like you said, but I imagined as a counselor to witness, you know, those situations where you're like, wow, like these individuals who maybe they felt like they were stuck in a certain circumstance, or they felt like, you know, whatever story they're telling themselves about themselves was the only true story, you know, to be told, like, oh, actually, no, you can rewrite your narrative or you can approach life a little differently. Must be a fun experience for you.

Speaker 2 4:24

It is and those aha moments that you just shared about with you and your husband, those are literally my favorite, just like though, wait, we need to stop and acknowledge this moment. It's obviously a lot easier, I think, as a third party, to sit back and watch two people engage with one another in a very specific way for a set amount of sessions. And then to see them make momentum. You don't always have that third party person, right? Or that neutral party being like, Wait, good job, like that was progress. You know, that was wonderful. So those are very special moments for sure.

Jen Amos 4:59

You Yeah, that's definitely something like nowadays now that we're really beginning to see the fruits of our labor and going through these sessions. It's like, I want to encourage every couple to go to counseling because it's so transformative. Gentleman's nodding. So I thought I'd check in with you,

Speaker 1 5:14

being you're speaking my language, like, this is what I do. People pay me to do this kind of outreach. So thanks for that. But no, I mean, having been in couples counseling myself, one counselor makes a huge difference. And having that person who's cheering you both on is just such a blessing. We tried several before we hit upon like the right mix of peoples some better than others. And you know, this last time we went at Cohen, we had a great experience, it was because of that championing of our therapists going, Hey, you guys are like actually putting in the work? Like, I know, it feels hard. I know, some of this still feels weird. There's old thing still coming up, and you're putting in the work? And I was like, Yes, I needed that. Like, I knew I needed that Pat, on the back, like to know that we were actually moving in a direction.

Speaker 2 6:04

Yeah, we do. We need to have those reflections on even the most minimal successes, right, because they set us up for more success and greater success in the future. I think another like, special moment that I always feel in a session is when I'm able to share, like, one reason I was drawn to counseling is because it had such a great impact in my younger life. And then I feel like in those moments, clients are like, Oh, you use this too? Okay. You know, there's that normalizing and just that unification, I guess, if you will, so,

Jen Amos 6:37

unched the legacy magazine in: 2017

Speaker 2 7:45

Yeah. So it was a long journey. I always preface this with I took about, I would say, six to nine months of kind of building a community building a platform, doing my research, what have independent publishers done before us, what is being done in the military service community already, so that we can kind of shine a different light, because there's a lot of good being done in our community, right. So we wanted to kind of come and rally what was already been done, rather than, you know, trying to recreate something very similar, if you will. So I spent about six to nine months working with various military spouse, veteran owned organizations, nonprofits, and just joining some research in that arena. And even before that, before I got necessarily plugged into the service community, I was very curious, when I first started dating my husband, about 11 years ago, was what was available, right? What was there for those that were wanting to know how the ones before us have kind of handled, you know, the challenges and the struggles that may come with the lifestyle. And while I did find content, I found the mainstream media often focused in two arenas, right there was this dramatization of the challenges right in the negatives. And then on the other side of that there was the romanticization. And there wasn't much in between, right. So you had this negative, you know, the movies with a show you about coming home from war, and almost 90% of that military community is shown in that light, or you had these romantic reels. what it looked like to be reunified. So I was very curious about the in between, right, because, well, both of those can be real, right? And both of those can be true experiences. I felt like we were missing a very big piece of the puzzle. So I started thinking why not help create This, so why not shine a light on the stories and the people and the couples and the families that were living in it day to day, right? And that were figuring it out as they went, Man, I felt like I was being encouraged by the people I was getting to know in my community and in the internet space. And I felt like others could be inspired by the same stories.

Jen Amos: 10:25

Yeah, I have to say, before we started recording, I went on your website and looked at the main video that you have posted on there. And I was telling Jenny Lynn, when she hopped on, I was like, Oh, my gosh, I was getting emotional. Because you really capture, like, one thing that really stood out to me, because, you know, I have a sensitive spot when it comes to relationships with daughters and fathers, you know, and there was a part in that video where the data saying I'm going to be deployed, but I'll be back, you know, and he's like, kissing his daughter. And I was like, Oh,

Unknown Speaker: 10:54

I was like hearing that right now.

Jen Amos: 10:56

Yeah, and just understanding that that is part of the day to day experience of military families. And so, you know, it just kind of brought me back to those times where like, dad was gone. But also the times when he did return. I just thought this just reminded me of like, I remember my dad was like, diploid, like, he'd always come back. And I say this, jokingly, he always came back and like a different weight. So sometimes he was like, overweight. And then he'd be gone, like months at a time. And then I think he like all he would use, like prunes or something. And then he come back, like super skinny. And it was like, Dad, like, You look different, you know, but you know, just remembering, like, those experiences of like, waiting by what do you call that, like the bay when the ship is coming in, and you see all the soldiers like standing on top of the ship, and like, all in uniform, and I just remember that when they were like entering in, and then, you know, when they started getting off the ship, and like, we're just trying to find that. But you know, that's part of like, the experience of the military family of having to like, I mean, those moments are the only moments, right? It's like, what happens after that? What happens before that? It's like, what happens when the service members in the House and like, you know, the spouse has already, like had their system in place? And then, you know, the service member, like messes up everything? Oh, yes. Like, or, like, for me, I remember I would sometimes, you know, like, if mom didn't let me have money, I'd go to dad, I was like, Hey, Dad, like I need like, $20. And he's like, okay, because he's not around often. So of course, he's gonna spoil me, you know. So just kind of like undermining my mom's authority, and stuff like that. But when, you know, when I saw that video, it just kind of brought me back to those memories of like, what it was like to be a military family. And that struggle of having dad gone like, once at a time and how mom dealt with it, you know? So I just really love that you touch upon the in between, you know, touching those stories where it's not over dramatized, or it's not over romanticize but really that day to day with our families.

: 12:48

Yes, absolutely. There was one article that one of our contributors wrote, I think it was in the second volume. And it was living life in the in between and live banality, I think is the word and I might be pronouncing that incorrectly. But it's just the idea of finding joy, finding peace, finding sustenance in that in between whether you're in between a deployment, and between duty stations, you know, in between jobs in between children. So just really embracing that challenge. Right? And in finding that silver lining. So it's been a joy to do that for sure.

Jen Amos: 13:25

Yeah, absolutely. I do have another question. But that I check in with Jennylyn. See if you wanted to add anything,

: 13:30

when it's manning the rails, that's when the sailor stand around the ship. Oh, okay. Thanks. Army thing they do, that's only a navy thing they do. So there's that? No, no, I mean, I think really, what you hit on is like, it's that reintegration piece. I mean, we're in a constant state of flux, and it's we're constantly reintegrating, it's always in between, I don't know that we ever have like a normal time where I mean, right now, we're waiting on orders. We've been waiting on orders for, I don't know, three months now, like still waiting on orders, you know, and that reintegration thing is huge. And I've always thought about it from a spouse perspective, because my kids were so little, the last time my husband deployed, but I mean, the orders we're waiting on are see duty orders. So we're about to go through all of this cycle again. And you know, my kids are going to be preteens, you know, doing this and what it will look like how it will be very different and everybody will have to have reintegration skills, which is why we all go to therapy. one more shout out for mental health. Yeah, for sure if we

Unknown Speaker: 14:34

haven't mentioned it, that's

: 14:40

one thing I'm seeing a lot in the mental health field is the exploration of that stress response and how military families often live and remain in a stress response, right was because we're constantly moving. We're constantly changing. We're constantly adapting and just seeing the effect because that has on the family as a whole. And that's something that we're starting to explore more through the articles. Because my hope when we started this was to bring to light the more challenging conversations, right? Not every family is going to utilize therapy necessarily, but let's maybe bring some of these materials and make them accessible to the greater community.

Jen Amos: 15:24

Yeah, definitely. I mean, it was only really, in the last two, three years that I didn't even know I literally didn't even know I was a Goldstar daughter until a couple years ago. And that's only because it's my husband's fault, because we because we work with the military community. And it got me to sort of like it sort of forced me to get in touch with my life before I met him in the military life. And when I heard about being a Gold Star family, I was like, I was like, How come? No one ever told me this. But you know, again, my mom, she was just focused on providing. But it was amazing, because the more I got to learn about it, the more I discovered resources dedicated to Goldstar families. And so there's a nonprofit that I'm a part of, I found out about the tragedy assistance program for survivors, or taps, for sure. And the website's taps.org. And it's actually a nonprofit dedicated to providing resources and support for Gold Star family members or surviving, you know, members of those we lost in the military. And it's been an emotional experience for me, because for a while, I didn't think that I could have help. I thought, like, Oh, I'm so far removed from the military, like, what can people give me like, and usually, if there's some kind of service, it's maybe for the Military Child, it's like, but I'm an adult child now at this point in my life. And so I think that if we just have more of those resources available, or even more education, and just putting it out there, you know, our military community can realize that from all walks of life in the military, whether you're a kid, a teenager, or an adult, or a spouse, or a veteran, or whatever, like there actually are these resources. And it's really providing that education with the in between, you know, I think what you're doing and so that's sort of what I was thinking about in this case, and why I continue to do this show, because I feel like I'm always learning something else new. That's not just good for me, but also good for our community as a whole, who are looking for what's available today, like what's available today. And who can I talk to today, that could help me today?

: 17:16

I think that is so important. And I heard a statistic before, and I'm sure you all are familiar how the military community represents roughly 1% of the population, and how one that felt surprising, right? Because you're when you're in it, it feels like it's everywhere. But two, I think for those that are in the civilian world, primarily, you're only when someone represents only 1% of a population, it might be easy to forget them, or it might easy to overlook them. So that's why I feel it's so important to be doing what you're doing, or what each of us are trying to do with different organizations is shining the light and sharing those stories, is connecting right the civilian world to the military world, and vice versa. One of my favorite things that my business partner and I did with legacy kids was we interviewed adult military children, and just the insights that came from them was so powerful and enlightening. So I love when you talk about, you know, well, I'm an adult military child. And where does that leave me? I just think there's so much there, right? There's so much wisdom, there's so much knowledge, and there's so much insight to be gained from adult military children.

Jen Amos: 18:38

I appreciate you sharing that, because I've been I think part of my upbringing, like the reason why I've been self employed for the last decade is because I moved around every two to three years as a kid. And then even once we sort of settled into San Diego, I still felt like we didn't settle like I moved to two different elementary schools. And then I went to middle school. And then I went to two different high schools. And the longest I stayed somewhere was college and I was what they call the super senior, it took me five years to graduate. And that was like, the longest I stayed anywhere. But even when I started to pursue my professional career, I got fired from like four jobs consecutively, because I just didn't have that mindset of like staying somewhere and climbing up the ladder. I was like, I just didn't have it in me. And so there was something so familiar about pursuing sales and being self employed that and I didn't know how to connect it to like my military upbringing until like, later in life. I was like, oh, that's why I couldn't hold the job. I just wasn't designed that way. I know. And I need to stop convincing myself that I could live that life that many Americans are fortunate to have where they stay in one town for a long time. And then maybe when they're 18, they want to go to college somewhere else, you know, but I just didn't have that same luxury and so I've gotten to a place where I've accepted my lifestyle. I've accepted the fact that I'm multifaceted and I'm okay with juggling different projects and having fun Multiple, like business ventures and but it took me a while to get there. I felt ashamed about it for a very long time.

: 20:06

Okay, and how powerful to be able to embrace that. And really what a gift right? I feel like that almost that chameleon like trait that you develop as a what I'm seeing my children develop. And when I've seen my friends that have grown up in the military, and then my friends that have older children in the military that chameleon like, personality or ability to me when harnessed, right and when encouraged. And when I guess cultivated, just can really served me well later in life.

Jen Amos: 20:38

Yeah, absolutely. Especially when you see it as a gift, not a curse. Absolutely. Because I could have easily have gone the other direction, say, Oh, I just can't commit to anything, you know, but it's like, no, it actually, it's actually a collective effort to, you know, to improve like, who I am as a whole as a person and everything. I do have another question, but I just thought I'd check in with anyone before I transition to that,

: 20:59

oh, no, that was great. I was gonna say back to the 1% thing, like, you know, I hear that statistic often. And actually, the last blue star family thing, active duty is actually less than point 5%. Now, which means that Abby and I are point two 5%, that's a quarter of a percent of the population. That's why I held up on the sticky note, I dropped that fat on a reporter recently. And he was like, Wait, say that again? I was like, Yeah, you heard that correctly, we're a quarter of a percent. And I think, you know, as we were talking about, like, overlooked or whatever, you know, a lot of times people throw around the 1%. And they're talking about, like, the most wealthy people in the world. And it's this like term of disdain. It's like, the 1%. And it's like, we talked about the 1%, I feel like we kind of get lumped into that, oh, you know, brushed off, because we are so small. And yet, you know, military spouses by statistics are more apt to volunteer for things, they're more apt to be the people at your church or in the organization's they're more apt to be the people in the PTO and PTA because, you know, we're conditioned to be of service. And so it's interesting to me that we keep getting smaller and smaller and smaller, percentage wise, but you know, our impact is actually quite large. And I think that's why it's confusing for people to be like, Wait, why is everybody talking about them being overlooked? And it's because we are so small, but the impact is so big that you forget, there are so few of us doing what's so impactful?

: 22:28

That's a good point. That's a good, good way of explaining that. That's so true.

Jen Amos: 22:34

Ya know, super, super powerful. And I appreciate you sharing. Lynn. I'm just curious to know, Abby, from your experience with legacy magazine. What kind of civilian feedback have you received? Like, have you had your civilian counterparts read this? And like, oh, my gosh, I had no idea. Like, what does that experience been like for you?

: 22:53

Yes, we've always tried to incorporate at least 10% of civilian contributors, organizations, supporters, because we felt if we were truly trying to help connect civilians, to the service community and the service community, to the civilians, we had to have their input, right. We even have civilian readers, because we don't necessarily approach the magazine with a lot of military paraphernalia, if you will. Like, we don't have a lot of uniforms on the cover, we don't have a lot of we are very intentional about that, in the sense of in looking at the service community, right, how much of your life truly happens, or how much of your partner's life truly happens in uniform, right? There's always that in between of like, at home, so we wanted to kind of shine a light. While yes, the uniform is great for recognition, right? In helping people recognize that it's a service product or a service organization. And we wanted to shine it in a different light. So we've even had individuals come to the website, pick it up in stores, and be like, Oh, this is a part of the service community. Wow, I never would have imagined. And then so many saying things like, I can relate to the story so much I can relate to these stories, so much. So to see that unity has been really impactful and inspiring.

Jen Amos: 24:25

I love that. It's like you're humanizing the military experience and creating that common ground for civilians to understand that, hey, we're not so different. We just happen to wear a uniform every now and then. Not all the time. Right. Obviously, that makes sense. But yeah, we are more than just the uniform. Like we have families. We have a life outside this we have dreams, you know. And so I think that I think that's really powerful. Even just looking at the design of your website. I don't feel like it's too military. You know, it's like it feels welcoming and soft and warm. And I know that was very intentional on your end.

: 24:58

The magazines are beautiful. All like they're so pretty. And she's right, you would not look at that and go, Oh, that's just for people connect to serve military connected, like they're just really pretty.

Jen Amos: 25:10

Yeah. Jenny Lynn, I'd love for you to share, like your experience and sharing your story with legacy magazine, at least what you currently have out there. And I know that you're working on a third one. So what does that meant for you, you know, to be able to contribute to this magazine?

: 25:22

Well, I am part of the inaugural issue of legacy kids, which was super fun sharing a story about one of my children who was obviously a military kid, which I have to say, when the photos are not of my son. They're by another military photographer, but they look like my son. And he even did a double take and was like, like, it's not you. It's not you. But he has been so happy to have his story somewhere. People come to our house, and he will show them. Like, look, this is about me. And again, the people that know us do a double ticket. They're like, that's not and I'm like, No, that's not someone else's beautiful story. You know, that has been really, really good for us as a family, especially for this child of mine in particular, who really kind of need some lifting up within the community. He's the oldest, so he's had more of the strain of military life than my younger one in some ways. So there's that. I'm sorry, I knew I was gonna cry during this episode. evitable. But I do. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Some people call it endearing. I'm like, I just wish I could get through anything without crying.

Unknown Speaker: 26:44

Got me to.

: 26:48

So when working with the legacy team has been really great. As of recording right now, I have a second piece with them about children's mental health that is out because my clinic that I represent was one of the founding like funders of the magazine. And so part of that was that we got to do some extra things with legacy to talk about military kids and mental health. So there's a piece on the blog today about military kids and their mental health and how the clinic I work for, and our network of clinics can support all military, Family Mental health issues. And coming up. It's on relationship. That's like the next theme. Yes. I don't want to like burst. I don't want to like ruin your reveal.

Unknown Speaker: 27:35

Okay, it feels a little snapshot.

: 27:39

Yeah. So, you know, I'll have a piece about what it's like to be in a military relationship. And as we circle back to mental health for the United time, this thing, I mean, really, really good mental health that, you know, my family has received, that I'm able to even write a piece about relationships, like there was a time that I don't know that that would have been possible. I've been married almost 12 years. Not all of them great. You know, and because of the mental health help that we have received, my husband came home the other day, and his current job is not easy. And he just kind of walked in, and he gave me a hug. And he was like, I'm just so glad we're in a good place. And I was like, what is that what is happening? And he's like, it's just been a day. And it's just like this constant pandemic life and the constant stress. And he's like, I don't know that we would have been able to have the conversations we've had or, you know, I'll be in the same house for ever in a day without having the help that we've had. And it was really reassuring that the work we've put in is doing good. And doing well.

Jen Amos: 28:52

Ya know, beautifully said, Jenny Lynn, I just wanted to take a moment here. And thank you. I mean, first of all, I'm so glad you're my co host. You know, just because I'm so glad that you said yes. Or you reached out like early on when I said I was looking for a co host, I really didn't expect you know that. I'm just so glad. Yeah, I didn't expect I wouldn't know what to expect when you came on and what I come to find and every time, every new interview we do together, you're just so unapologetic about sharing your story. And I know a part of it has a lot to do with the self healing you've done and the Mental Health Services you've benefited from. And also understanding that this is not just about you, this is about the people you can help and people that you can reassure that hey, like you're not alone, you know, you're not alone in this journey. So, you know, just thank you for being an example of a spouse who is really modeling like self care, and reminding us that we're not alone in this community. So thank you for doing that. I didn't pay you to cry, but just thank you for your honesty and it's greatly appreciated as you continue to just be more open and transparent on our show. Oh,

: 30:00

oh, thank you. This is a great joy for me. And I'm happy to be here.

Jen Amos: 30:05

Ya know for sure I can tell. Abby, I wanted to check in with you to anything you wanted to add to anything that gentleman said.

: 30:13

I would just the example of the power of story right in sharing our story and how, when we put in the hard work, it not only impacts us directly, it not only impacts our families directly, but it impacts everyone that we are willing to share it with. I don't know how many times I've heard from readers and contributors that just being able to hear some of the harder topics discussed and gone, explored on a deeper level, how that has helped them get through certain seasons, is just my heart. And my gratitude goes out to each and every person that steps up to the plate and just bravely shares their experience, to do the work in their own life, right their internal world, they're in their families, and then to extend that out to others is just how I think we're going to truly see change and flourish meant in this community. So thank you, Jenny Lynn, for being one of those individuals.

: 31:19

Happy to be I think sometimes some days, I wonder, could there been an easier path? I'm not sure.

Jen Amos: 31:27

I find though, it's like I personally find it is very self healing to tell my story. Okay. It's one thing for the reader to appreciate that and empathize or sympathize, however, you want to say it like to sort of get a glimpse of what this life has been like. But I think it especially benefits the person telling the story, because like what you said, Abby, it's like that individual had to do the inner work, you know, to show up and share such a vulnerable story. And I do feel like in especially in the times of pandemic, it's so easy to isolate ourselves and feel like we're alone and feel like our story is like weird and strange and, you know, not worthy to be shared, or, you know, listened to. And so I don't take for granted every guest who's been on our show, and I'm sure you don't take for granted everyone who has shared their story in your magazine.

: 32:18

Absolutely. I think one of the most enjoyable things for me, was when I realized so you know, when you go into starting a, an organization, or a nonprofit or a podcast, that you're hoping to serve others, right, you're hoping to help impact others. But then you receive just as much inspiration by those that contribute by those that read that those that write, and that's been such an exciting thing to experience to not only like, help create something in the world that is impactful, but to also be blessed by that. Is that right in? So yeah, I agree with you, I

Jen Amos: 33:01

get a kick out of this. Like, it's like, oh, this is not just for everyone else. This is for me, it's like it's always nice to be reminded that I wasn't alone, or I'm not alone in this journey, this crazy journey of this crazy military community that we are the less than 1%. Don't forget, it's so genuine hinted at the inauguration of legacy Kids magazine. So can you tell us in the middle of a pandemic, what inspired you? Yeah. Another magazine?

: 33:30

Well, so we had been, I guess, so legacy was launched in 2017. And we were, I believe, in our fifth volume, when one of our readers reached out to me and said, Hey, would you ever be open to the idea of launching a volume just for children. And so she was sharing kind of her experience of what her children were kind of processing through his dad went through these cycles of deployments. And she felt that if she was having these experiences, chances are many others were having these experiences, right. And one reason she felt drawn to the publication originally was because she said, the first time she read it, she felt like, like, wow, they're talking about things that you can't just necessarily talk about in a day to day conversation, right? If you meet someone new, and you're like, Okay, so I'm really having this issue with my husband right now. Right? So like, that's not usually on the table right away. So she felt drawn to that, and she was seeing the need for that and her own children. And so I said, Yes, like, I'm all in, let's do this. So we began to lay the groundwork. I believe she reached out her name is Dana Ray. And I believe she reached out in December. So prior to the pandemic, right, and then we started to lay the ground We started to do some research, we started to get some quotes, and then the printer started to do some market research. And then she, let's see, we're both in the same town. So it may be a little easier at first to, you know, kind of have our little powwow bells. But despite the pandemic, we felt like there was still a need for of it, maybe now more than ever, right? Kids were not going to school full time, you know, parents were having to adapt tremendously when it came to how do we fill our children's time, you know, other than screen time, right? So it really provided an opportunity for us to offer something to the community that could be impactful. So we went full force ahead, one of our spouses was deployed at the start of it and returned home and then the other spouse deployed

: 35:49

at the end of it. We just did what all military spouses do that just keep going. I

Jen Amos: 35:58

love it. That's so exciting. And you know, just what gentleman was sharing earlier on your son, being able to have his story featured must be no is amazing. And I appreciate that you're doing this for the kids of our military community or service community, as you say it today. So it's powerful. I'm curious to know now with both of the magazines, clearly at this point, I would imagine that people want to get the magazine. So walk us through the process of getting the magazine how accessible it is, how can they get started. So

: 36:28

you can visit legacy magazine.org. And you'll find all six volumes of legacy magazine and the first inaugural volume of legacy kids, what started as a single volume, we believe will be an annual publication for the legacy kids. That's the plan right now. And then a legacy magazine traditionally releases twice a year. So both of those are available in print, and digitally. And we have subscription options, which gives you a discount offer when you subscribe. So all of that is that legacy magazine.org.

Jen Amos: 37:08

I love it. And you have to tell me, why did you choose the name legacy for your magazine?

: 37:15

I feel like that came to me where it found me if that makes sense. I didn't spend a lot of time trying different names, right legacy just kind of felt right, if you will. And I was thinking about, you know, I think oftentimes we think about, it goes back to that in between. It's not necessarily like the money we leave our children or our families or our loved ones. And it's not the material things, but it's the how do we build that legacy in the day to day, so it's kind of shining a different light on legacy. And what that means in this community specifically.

Jen Amos: 37:59

I like that it's not necessarily about what you leave behind. But it's what you're doing in your day to day and realizing that you don't have to wait till the end to leave something wonderful. You can leave something wonderful right now. You can do it right. salutely.

So that's a great way to, like you said redefine the word legacy. Yeah. Oh my gosh, Abby, I feel like we could talk forever, but you are a licensed counselor, and your time is valuable. So is there any final thoughts or anything else you want to share with us? Before we wrap up,

: 38:29

I just want to say thank you for the work that both of you ladies are doing. It's having an powerful impact on our community. And it's an honor to be a small part of it. So thank you.

Jen Amos: 38:41

Well, thank you for what you do, obviously, it just, you know, fangirl all around. No, it's great. It's just nice to know that there are so many good people in our tiny community and making a big impact. So thank you so much for saying that. And Jacqueline, any closing thoughts on your end?

: 38:57

This was wonderful. Probably going to cry a little more after we close it down. No, thank you so much for the work that you do. And I love how you define legacy. I think especially in regard to legacy kids like we do have such so much to offer them and teach them about what our day to day looks like. You know, my kids are almost preteens and it's interesting the life we've led the things that are normal and abnormal, both good and bad, that will forever make an impact on how how they see the world like I mean, like Jen mentioned, you're an entrepreneur now because well, you hopped around your whole life, something I would have never thought of because I lived within 15 miles of my first house until I got married to someone in the service. You know, so I can appreciate how this lifestyle is leaving a legacy on our kids that will forever impact who they are and how they see the world.

Jen Amos: 39:53

Awesome. All right. Well, let me go ahead and wrap this up then to our listeners. We hope that today's episode gave you One more piece of knowledge resource a relevant story so you can continue to make confident and informed decisions for you and your family. I look forward to speaking with you in the next episode. Tune in next time