004: Discussing the medical benefits of cannabis for someone living with chronic pain with Angela Vasquez

Jen Amos 0:00

There's no need to wait on your service member to share secondhand information anymore. Welcome to holding down the fort, a podcast show where we put military spouses and children's needs front and center so that they can make informed decisions together as a family. Because let's face it, we know who's really holding down the fort. Let's get started

Okay, hi everyone. Jen amo is here with holding down the fort Podcast. I'm really excited because I get to chat with Angela Vasquez today. Angela is a Coast Guard spouse, a mother of two, a cannabis advocate and the owner of box of knots. Angela, welcome to the show.

Unknown Speaker 0:56

Thank you for having me.

Jen Amos 0:58

I'm glad that you responded to me.

Speaker 1 1:00

Yeah, no, I'm, I saw a couple tags actually, of quotes that you had put in your new page for your podcast. And I thought it was pretty cool that you're going and kind of Insta stalking some spouses and seeing kind of what we're up to. And now putting it out on your podcast. It's cool.

Jen Amos 1:18

Yeah, yeah. Respectfully insists stalking not yes, no,

Speaker 1 1:22

yeah, that's respectful. And I do the same, you know, you gotta, you have to see what, what's out there.

Jen Amos 1:28

Yeah, in a previous interview, I was just talking to another military spouse about how social media is so powerful for the military community, because it's really become our virtual home, especially if you get deployed, or you have to move to another place and what have you. And so Instagram, I feel like is especially the place for a lot of military spouses to be active and to build a community. So I'm not sure if you felt the same way. But it to me, it feels like Instagram is like of all the social media accounts. Like that's the one that a lot of military spouses are very active on.

Speaker 1 2:02

Oh, for sure. For me, even the I want to say the day it came out, I, or even the week it came out, I signed up. And it was the year that I first moved and was became a military spouse. So I feel like I've been with it from the startup. So it's been, it's been cool to see how other spouses have been able to use it to connect as well.

Jen Amos 2:23

Yeah, absolutely. So let's talk about first of all, I know I invited you on to the podcast, but I'd love for you to share why you chose to be on the podcast to share your story. And all the fun stuff we're gonna get into today. I guess I chose

Speaker 1 2:38

to be on it, because I'm usually the one doing the interviewing. And because I do also have my own podcast and kind of the project I've been working on with boxer knots. So to be on the other side of it, and to have other people interested in kind of what I'm trying to say. I felt like it was an opportunity to say what I need to say. So I know that there's from Instagram, because that's kind of my main point of contact with my followers that they're, they're stoked that I was doing this interview with you. Just to put the information out there and so that other people know other spouses know that they're not alone.

Jen Amos 3:16

Yeah, it definitely. I also think if I'm getting interviewed, it's I feel a little more relaxed, because I don't have to initiate anything. So hopefully, you're in a more relaxed position.

Speaker 1 3:29

Yeah, I always felt like the intros are always like, you know, like the nerves are there. But the minute you start talking like it becomes more of a conversation and less of like an interview. So I appreciate that side of it. You're easy. You're easy to talk to. So that helps, too.

Jen Amos 3:42

Oh, good. Good. I'm glad in the couple of minutes. We've spoken. I'm already easy to talk to.

Unknown Speaker 3:49

Yeah, yeah.

Jen Amos 3:50

Yeah. All right. Well, for anyone that is hearing about you for the first time, Angela, why don't you tell us a little bit about your life today. If people were to get a snapshot of your life, what would it look like? Other questions I like to ask is what keeps you busy and excited nowadays.

Speaker 1 4:08

So I'd say my life is pretty eclectic. And if you were to take a stroll through my feed, you'd see a splash of my kids, you'd see any recent works and progress that I'm doing. And I like to post inspirational stuff like quotes and stuff like that to kind of help my, my, I don't like to call them followers, but help my friends kind of get through the day. So I'd say my day, I highlight in my day is that I've made my goals a priority. And it's been a full year of I mean, that's hard to like, have kids and be a military spouse and to actually say like, put your foot down and say look, I'm going to try this and I have to give it my all or nothing's gonna happen of it. So really just having that time and my mom, she's like my rock, she's supported me from day one. She'll always be They're, so she, she gets that. And she gets that I need not only as a mom, but as a creative, I need that alone time to just work. And to kind of just dive into things. So my highlight of my day is, I'd say, like, the afternoon, when, you know, everyone's kind of going and doing their own things, and I can just do my thing and focus on my box mods project.

Jen Amos 5:23

Yeah, yeah, I was looking at some of the work you did. And you're very, you're very creative, very artistic. It looks like what you do is a lot of fun, but definitely takes a lot of alone time. And I think it's awesome that you have found a way to do that, because I, you know, I don't have kids, but I have this dog with separation anxiety. And so he's always with me. And I always have to find a way to exhaust him, so that he can just be asleep. While I'm, for example, doing a podcast show, and he's not barking in the background.

Speaker 1 5:58

Yeah, honestly, for the podcast, that's been the hardest one to dedicate time to, because you have to have all the stars lined Rino, because if you record something bad, you're not gonna put it out there. You know, I've heard that kind of situation, I have to make sure everyone's gone. But my son for right now. He's homeschooled. So he's, for the most part, he'll kind of manage himself. But it's like the time stuff the day where he needs my attention. And I have to put put everything down and focus on on him. So those kinds of distractions, and then to come back and sit down at the desk and say, Where was that? And you know, to get back into that flow of it. That part is hard. So that's like the the only struggles I would say that I have with it.

Jen Amos 6:40

I agree. I I have to make sure I like no one is bothering me. And even if there's a distraction, I have to keep the mic running or to keep recording. Because if I try to record later, the sound, the sound is off.

Unknown Speaker 6:54

Yeah, yeah. lines up. And yeah, I get Yeah, I mean, it just sounds

Jen Amos 6:58

like really weird. I have to put like a commercial in between. Like what I pre recorded, and then when I record the second part, well, awesome. Thank you for sharing a little bit about your life with us today. The purpose of holding down the fort podcast is to provide education and resources to military families and spouses that they wouldn't otherwise get from the military, from the government or just from places where we probably should get them. And so the main topic I wanted to discuss with you today is cannabis advocacy. And my first question for you is do you feel like there's enough cannabis education out there, especially for military spouses today?

Speaker 1 7:37

I would say other than the first thing that pops up on Google, there is no advocacy for spouses and cannabis that

Jen Amos 7:49

you're like, No,

Speaker 1 7:50

there there isn't. And that's part of why I started to share a lot on my Instagram, because I was spending so much time in my messages, just like talking to people about their personal situations. And I'm like, Okay, if there's like 10 or 20 people, there has to be more. And it's just become super apparent that there's so many issues tied around that, especially like that military spouses and cannabis.

Jen Amos 8:21

Yeah, what do you feel like? Most people, if there's this assumption about cannabis? What do you think that assumption typically is?

Speaker 1 8:30

I'd say the typical assumption is that you're a stoner trying to escape something, you just want to veg out on the couch and have the munchies and giggle all night. Which honestly, I've been using it for 12, almost 13 years, and I've never had one of those giggle on the couch. And you know, it's like, yeah, it just, it's it's not it's not that it's all like Hollywood. Yeah, play, but as a military spouse with kids, and you know, like, that's not

Jen Amos 9:05

how it looks for us. Yeah, that probably wouldn't be very productive with your time.

Speaker 1 9:09

Not at all, especially half of the time we're doing it solo. And you know, our spouse has deployed so it makes a big difference when we can function versus doing it miserably.

Jen Amos 9:20

Right. Right. So let's talk about what people should know. Because I know that you really educate people on Instagram, you have an inside story where you really get into the products and what they do, and I know that it helps you as well. Health wise that correct?

Speaker 1 9:38

Yeah, I can I don't know how far you back. You want me to go but I could tell you because I feel like it kind of tells a story of how I really feel like my use started off hiding it from my parents to discovering it was medicinal, and that was really when it became medicinal in California. And then When I transitioned, when I was dealing with my injuries and dealing with basically using narcotics versus cannabis, and then going into the military, like everything, like was just so one after the other, that I was always challenged with, Am I doing the right thing? am I breaking laws is right for me. But I always knew I knew since I was 13 years old, that cannabis made me feel like myself. And that was the main thing.

Jen Amos: 10:30

Wow, I liked that you knew at such a young age, I didn't even know about cannabis till I mean, college when it was, you know, perceived the way that it was the way that you described it, but to learn even in the recent years, that it does have medicinal properties. And even someone such as my myself that started using CBD oil for my hip pain, it really makes a difference. And I'm surprised that, you know, not more people know about it. But I do understand the fear around it as well, because of what popular culture has, you know, put out there about it.

: 11:02

Yeah, and the, the stigmas behind it, really, I mean, people care, they care what people think about them. And that's really the root of it. And it came to me personally having to tell myself that I don't care, I don't care what anyone thinks, if I don't do this, I'm not going to have the will to live, I'm not going to feel like myself, I'm not. And it really became to a point where I was just in so much pain, and anyone who's lived in any type of pain, like fibromyalgia or any, any type of pain that you wake up with on a daily basis, you have to like find somewhere deep in there to get up out of bed like that's a literal thing. And to know that you can have something like a vape pen, or a gummy or dissolvable breast strip that you could put on your tongue or something so tiny, that can help you within 10 minutes, and to totally change your mood to where you can get up and be the happy mom that your kids like need you to be and not want you to be in whatever it needs you to be. It makes all the difference. It makes all the difference in the world. Because it's not like Dad's going to come home any minute and help you with anything because that's deployed. Yeah, that's just one of those situations.

Jen Amos: 12:13

Yeah, you really have to be supermom while while he's away. So let's say for a military spouse who is interested in getting medicinal, like a CBD oil or just cannabis related products, what do you feel like is the the first thing they need to know? What do you recommend they first look into? Or how do they start? Yeah,

: 12:38

yeah. So right off the bat, I have this one, I guess article, you can call it on my it's a blog post. But it's very informative. And it's on my website, vox.com. And it tells you about how cannabis is naturally already in your system. And a lot of people don't believe that. And they're like, Yeah, but whatever. But if you break down all the compounds, and the cannabinoids, they are naturally already in your system. And some people like me have a deficiency. So I don't have just like dopamine and serotonin and all the things that you hormones can produce, and people lack and here and there, for me, I don't produce the natural amount that I need for my pain signals to be numb enough to like not fire off all of these false pain signals to my brain telling me like I'm really not in all this pain. It's the fibromyalgia it's the Lyme disease, it's the, it's all the CO infections of the mold, the mold exposure. And it's not really like my, you know, I'm not in that pain as my body perceives. So the fact that if you can just understand that you already naturally have an amount in your system. And you can either have, like 2020 vision kind of style thing, or you might need a little bit less, the whole purpose behind is that you test yourself. And it's all trial and error, obviously start from the lowest doses. And they all range depends which what you use, if you use any kind of tincture, which is like a dropper oil that you could put in your coffee in the morning or something like that. There's there you can put it under your tongue, there's gummies, everything is dosed in different ways. So that's the part where everyone gets super confused and overwhelmed. And they don't even know where to start. I always say search for wherever your sources, whether I hate to say this, whether it's a drug dealer that you know, that you find because you live in a state where you can't find it, or whether it's some service you find online or whether you live in a legal state and you're able to actually get your hands on some things that are tested, like where I've been able to get recently. Always ask what is the lowest you have start from there, and it's trial and error you you'll know within, like I say, when I tell my friends to start, I say do the same dose for three days and then see how you feel. All right.

Jen Amos: 14:54

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: 16:17

And I have the life book, which is something else off my website. But I have these layouts where I help you guys track, like your usage in a day, in a week in a month, and how you're feeling and all of that. So because that was another thing for me trying to figure it out. And not having a Google search that I could go to that would help me figure out what works for me, really just monitoring it writing down how you feel how you feel is really important. Because your body can feel a different role in your mind, your mind can feel different than your muscles you like there's so many different ways to listen to your body. And that's really part of it, learning to listen to your body. And then using the CBD and the cannabis with THC, whatever parts you use of it as a tool.

Jen Amos: 17:01

I like how you encourage people to do this life book and track you know how much dosage you're taking every day, and how it's making them feel. Because it's one thing to feel pain. But I think a lot of times, we tend to quickly brush off how we feel. And I like that you mentioned that because like your feeling is just the way you feel is just as important as how your body is feeling.

: 17:25

Oh, for sure. And even like, like, let's say if you have kids like for me, I would literally write down in my life book, the time I took the dose, how much it was. And then anything that happened that day, like me and my son got into a little argument over this, you know something, and then how I dealt with it, I would write down because if you're dealing with a situation like that, where you have to reprimand your child and you're dealing with a lot of pain, sometimes you might be a little harsher than you you shouldn't be because you're not even thinking about that you're intensified being able to see that written down in your face like oh, well, I was like, I honestly the same air quotes good mom, I did that, you know, in a good mom sense. Or, man, I could have did that better. And just monitoring that like that really helps me see my dosage as well. Because if I wrote down, oh, I took a really long nap, then that might have been way too much of a dose for me. So those are different ways to catalogue and there's no one size fits all it goes off of what you eat and put goes off of what you put in your body, how much sugar water, you intake, all of that it feeds into it. So it's really, really taking like being an advocate for your body and, and for yourself and just kind of being in tune with all of it. And then like I said, just using it as a tool and not so much recreational.

Jen Amos: 18:45

Right, right. Essentially, cannabis is not the magic medicine, you have to be proactive with everything else that you're doing. You know, you mentioned the way that you're feeling the things that you're eating. We had we just said our mother in law started taking CBD oil. We keep asking her how do you feel? Do you Did you notice anything? And she's like, No, I don't. But the things that she eats the carbs that she takes the wine she drinks every night I think there's a lot of factors into probably why she isn't feeling it right away or maybe she needs to like increase her dosage. But I like that you say that it's really not a one size fits all it's not really something a doctor can tell you to do either you really just have to be you know one with your body and be your own you know your own doctor and track your you know, track how you're feeling and, and I really liked the emphasis on the Lifebook

: 19:34

Yeah, and I've always put it out there too especially recently and I'll say my messages here and or my stories here and there. Message me like Find a buddy that you feel like might know a little more than you about cannabis and even if they don't, they might be able to connect you with someone who does and just finding someone who you can ask the questions that you're struggling with like I've been offering like we'd profile I call them we profiles but they're terpene profiles terpenes is a huge thing. There's natural terpenes, there's cannabis terpenes, some companies are using natural, some are using cannabis terpenes. But the point just being that there's so many different like ingredients, basically like almost like baking a cake. There's so many different ingredients that you can add for different effects and the fact that the it's all out there, it's just the resources on getting your hands on it. And then the stigmas people have behind buying it like with my daughter, we were blessed to be in an area that was very accepting of it. But we lived in San Francisco, which you can assume is probably very cannabis friendly. And a lot of the doctors there were hesitant to treat me when I was pregnant with my daughter. But I did find some doctors that were basically like a whole team of doctors who were pro cannabis versus all the other pills that could have been taking. Yeah. And they basically like they were the ones who gave me the information like, look, there's this whole world of terpenes. And like that no one even knows about because no one's shining a light, but just being able to safely use. And I hate to say years, but to take cannabis my entire pregnancy. And it's all types of waves, creams, oils, smoking vaping. And however I needed to get through that pregnancy. It helped it helped having the right information and not just going to the corner and buying from somebody because that was all I could get my hands on.

Jen Amos: 21:30

Yeah, I would like to meet those doctors. In the Bay Area. Take those references. Yeah. I think that's awesome. And I think that's what I enjoy about talking to people who are cannabis advocates is because they're very educated in it, wherein if you just go to the doctor, they just give you pills. And that's kind of the end of it. And they don't really talk more than that. It's like, oh, let's start you with this pill that I don't know what the ingredients are in it and stuff. I was recently, just just a couple of weeks ago, my doctor diagnosed me with mild depression. And immediately she was like, Oh, we're gonna start with like, a low dosage of antidepressants. And I was like, How did you even know? Like, how could you even tell that I have like mild depression and that my serotonin levels are low and that I need this particular antidepressant. I'm still in denial of it, I have decided to do the cannabis route. And, and if anything changes, maybe I'll consider it. But it's just odd that to me, I feel like there should be more options and just, you know, prescribing antidepressants to people.

: 22:38

And it's funny that you brought that up, because the exact same thing happened to me last week. And really, I got a call like the next day saying, Hey, you never picked up your prescription. Like, I'm just gonna walk out of your office and go straight to a pharmacy and get a prescription than I am nothing about. Like I need to do my research first before I put that in my body.

Jen Amos: 22:57

Exactly. Yeah, it's so funny like that. That happened to me too. So I didn't realize that they had the my prescriptions ready for me. And I got a call from the pharmacy seven days later. And they said, Hey, your for your, you know, your prescription has been sitting here for seven days, and we're gonna restock it after, you know, 12 days. And then oddly enough, I went to the pharmacy, and I asked for it. And they said it. And so I originally, I'm in Virginia right now, I used to live in California. They said, Oh, like it. This is just your information from California. We don't see your prescription here. And I was like, Oh, all right. Cool. And so I just kind of left. And I haven't even talk to the doctor about like the fact that my prescription was supposedly not there. And I guess I'll bring it up to her next time I see her but I was just kind of glad. I think that was kind of a sign that okay, maybe I didn't want her to need it. Yeah, exactly. So I didn't need it. I don't want it. I mean, there's other there's more natural ways, in my opinion to increase your serotonin levels. But who knows, I could be making a grave mistake, but we'll find out.

: 24:01

I think you'll you're able to, I don't even like saying like you're at the age or whatever. Because I try to teach my kids even at this age, listen to your body, like that type of thing. Because I didn't even learn to listen to my body till it was like too late. And I'm to back surgeries. And so it's one of those things that you have to it's a mindfulness thing you have to acquire. And so I think that's good that you're, you know, you you know that there's other ways to naturally raise your serotonin and you don't have to subscribe to a pill once a day.

Jen Amos: 24:33

Yeah, thank you. I appreciate that. I'm giving myself a pat on the back too, for doing Yeah. So we have you have hinted at a blog that you have boxing knots and also your podcast show. I'd love to hear a little bit more about that and why you created it. I know it's a little similar to what we're doing here in terms of building a community, which is really exciting because I think we'll be connected for some time and maybe having each other on each other. shows in the future. I'd love to hear a little bit about boxing knots and, and I do want to be able to reference the article and the life book that you were talking about in our show notes later. So yeah,

: 25:12

cool. That'd be awesome. Box of knots started off literally as me just searching some different domain names, trying to find myself a blog, I had gone to college for a million things, one of them being web design. So I always knew since MySpace days that I wanted a website that was basically like a catalogue of my life for my kids and for my family, whoever. So when we moved to New Jersey and 2012 I went, my son was born 2011 We got married, we like it, everything was really fast. And so I'm like, let me just make a blog that I can like start cataloging thing. Right after we moved. I found out I got Lyme disease I had gotten bit by Oh my god. Yeah. And I had even never heard of a tic in my life. And it was already at a point where the antibiotics were not going to help at all. So they were on the East Coast. They're very used to it. So they're very like, oh, well, it's okay. Everyone has a you'll be okay. So, we were stationed there for four years, and I've lived there the entire four years believing it's okay, just like it's gonna go away. And like, it'd be fine. I dealt with a lot of my back pain and everything. I still was blogging the whole way through some time between then and my back surgery, and my website crashed. And I lost all of my blog posts. Oh, no, yeah, that's like the I still have the hard drive that I hope one day I'll run into the right person who can fix it for me, because my entire website is sitting on there. And it's like, it's honestly, probably four years of writing. And yeah, it's sad to know it's sitting on there. But anyways, yeah, and I had my, my spinal fusion. And after my surgery, I and I've talked about it in my stories and my highlights and my stories on Instagram that I had this moment, like when I woke up from my back surgery, where I thought I was dead. And I was like, I was in so much pain. And they had told me we you are on the maximum amount of morphine and this and that, and every kind of drug you can give me, there's nothing else we can give you. And I just like looked at my husband and I'm like, Give me my phone and take a picture of me because I don't believe none of you guys that I'm like, literally alive. So he took a photo of me and I shared it on there because I think it that for me was my wake up call like okay, and like you from this point on need to learn to control the pain on the inside, like wherever it's at. And like, like even if you're just stuck in this body that you can't even move right now. You need to control it from the inside. So the minute I think it was like my I was in the hospital for a week, like the second day and my husband came back, he I got me a new iPhone, because I was going to be in the hospital for a week from that plan. And I just kept blogging and writing and I was just just kind of documenting my journey and when you're in a hospital and you know you want to get out there make you do ABC before you can even get there to get to the discharge point. That was my goal I just wanted I hadn't seen my son I wanted to get home we were the surgery was in Philadelphia. And so that was a few hour drive from New Jersey where we were at. So I just I wanted to get home so I did everything that I could. And I really just wanted to smoke to be honest. But you know, I'm in the hospital. So literally on my way home, we stopped at the dispensary in New Jersey, it takes you two years to get your medicinal license. You have to see a doctor for two years to prove that you have the condition, which is such a loophole. Wow. Yeah. And so on the way home, I all cut up and everything I waddled in because no one was allowed to get my medicine for me. Got my meds went home. And I was home for three months. I couldn't bend twist or anything. I couldn't even wipe my own anything. You know, yeah. So my husband was my saint. He was just my backbone for everything. And my outlet was just Instagram and building this community and finding people that were like, not feeling bad for me more so like, not, I don't even like saying inspire like people, people being inspired by me. But if I can inspire somebody to get up and you know, take care of their kids better than they did yesterday or not let their illness be come them you know, like, yeah, then I'll keep sharing. I'll keep sharing my experience and it just kind of evolved from that. So it's been from 2012 until now. And to be honest, it wasn't until I know the exact moment. So my anniversary is December 23. And me and my husband went shopping and like did a little and we had like no money. We're really broke. We're the paycheck to paycheck kind of military family. We went shopping and I wasn't listening to the news about like, there was going to be a show it down and I just I was kind of doing the out of sight out of mind thing. Like, if I wasn't watching the news, maybe it wouldn't happen. The next day after we found out there was gonna be no paycheck. And it was Christmas. It was it was everything me. Yeah. And that was like such a wake up call because my husband was going to be deployed January 2, my daughter was about to turn one years old, it was just a lot. Actually, she wasn't even she Yeah, it was, it was a lot. I turned to my Instagram community. And when my knots I called them, and I started to sell, I made 10 Life books. And they were sold almost instantly. And my friends and to me, 10 was like, a lot, that was a lot of people to be interested in something that I was gonna make on my kitchen table. And it just turned into this community of people who were basically anxiety ridden, depressed, dealing with postpartum depression, post traumatic stress disorder, all types of things that they didn't have the tools. And I just had so many years of physical therapy and cognitive behavior therapy. I had the tools and I'm a graphic designer by trade, I went to college. So yeah, why am I not doing this for other people, I just started doing it. And it just it spun off from there hasn't even been a year, to be honest, since I've made it like my, my full time thing. But it just spun off into me kind of just trying to be there for other people by being there for myself.

Jen Amos: 31:29

Wow, well said, I love that I and I appreciate you sharing that and definitely going to add information about your website and community in the show notes. And I like how, you know you mainly focused on taking care of yourself first. And it just so happens that it helps other people where I think in other cases, some people focus on trying to sell something without any connection to it. And I think that's why your community is growing to be successful because or if it's not already, because they can relate, you know, to where you were coming from, and they and you're really helping them. So I think it's a really beautiful thing, what you're doing, and I definitely want to look into your life book. I'm like curious now is like we've been talking about this life book. And now I'm gonna have to like look it up myself. Well, Angela, I

: 32:20

have had such a pleasure speaking with you today. I think we covered a lot talk about cannabis advocacy and VOCs and knots and you know your story, and I appreciate you being extremely transparent about it. For anyone that wants to get a hold of you, how would they be able to contact you?

: 32:38

I would say the best way to contact me quickly is Instagram. And then other than that, of course, my website box of knots.com. That's where you could find me my Etsy links. You can find my blog posts all kinds of things.

Jen Amos: 32:51

Cool. Cool. And do you have any closing thoughts for our listeners?

: 32:56

I do always like to leave people with like something to kind of carry them to the day. Whatever it is you're dealing with. I always tell people live in the solution. Don't focus on the problems just live in the solution.

Jen Amos: 33:08

That's good. Live in the solution. That should be a hashtag. Yeah. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Angela. I appreciate your time. And for anyone that is listening, and this episode resonated with you anyway, please visit our show notes. You could actually leave us a voicemail message or you can shoot us an email. And hopefully we'll be able to read that in the next show. And if you really liked Angela, maybe we'll have her on again. Okay, Angela, thank you so much for your time and thank our listeners. Yes. All right. Take care. Thank you so much for listening to the holding down the fort podcast show. To leave us a message. Please visit our show notes to learn how or you can email us at holding down the fort podcast@gmail.com Until next time,